I have been pumping and feeding Braeden up until now. But I return to work next week, so we are switching to formula. Right now I am using filtered water to make the formula. What is best - filtered, bottled, tap?

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Sue, Collin 6/16/01 and Braeden 11/19/04

Hello, My ds is 5 months old and since he was born I BF and FF him. I always bought Poland spring bottled water. I buy them so when I travel all I have to do is use the water at room temp to mix the formula. I asked my ped. and they said that is fine. I also asked about the water they sell at Babies r us and the said not to use that one because it has floride and he does not need that rite now and if I want I can use tap water. NYC tap water has floride and is suppose to be one of the best water suppliers.

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Dawn

I would definately stick with filtered water or bottled water. I, for the most part, use filtered water and have on occassion used bottled wated for the added fluoride (Nursery baby water) <<< link. I would stay away from just plain tap water due to the lead and other stuff in it that's not good for even adults. JMO. HTH. Good luck!

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oh yeah, about fluoride...
Just wanted to point out again, that I only used it every so often and it is good for when they're closer to teething.

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I use bottled drinking water. We don't drink tap water, so we don't use it in bottles. I do cook with tap water, and the dr. told me that is enough flouride for adults and kids- as long as it's used in cooking. The dr. also told me it's not necessary for babies, but I certainly don't think flouride would hurt if it was in the water, and I don't think it's bad.

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SAHM to Gabrielle 9/98 and Alec 4/04
Wife to Jeff since 3/96

We use the Nursery Water. I dont trust tap water at all and have never given it to her. Regular bottled water is fine but I like the added flouride the Nursery water provides.

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Amy (21) and Matt (23)~~ Our Princess Valerie Nicole Born 2/10/04
7 Pounds 8.9 Ounces 19 Inches Long
TTC #2 Thinking Pink Again!!!!!!!!!!!!!

we use our tap water-it's very natural & is actually even sold bottled in stores.

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but if I am somewhere else, even in the next town I will bring my own or just use bottled

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Hi. I have been studying fluoride for about 6 years now. Last year, my partner's daughter gave birth to a beautiful baby boy. In order to avoid fluorosis - a staining of the teeth in later childhood and adults, and other associated undesirable effects, we make his formula on bottled fluoride-free water. It is important to make sure the sodium level in the water is under 15mg/ltr. Recently the American Dental Association and the Center for Disease Control repeated a warning to parents NOT to give fluoride to children under 1 year of age and NOT to make up formula with tapwater! Dr.Stephen Levy from Ohio, probably the world's foremost expert on fluoride, stated that the first 12 months of a baby's life are the MOST important in deciding whether the child will have fluorosis, and to what extent. Obviously, the risks can be reduced by not giving fluoride to young children. The debate about fluoride rages on, but if I were you, I would excercise the precautionary principle and keep your baby away from this stuff! If you would like to educate yourself about the fluoride debate, here are some links to get you started:** http://www.fluoridealert.org/dental-fluorosis.htm , http://bruha.com/pfpc , www.voiceireland.org
P.S. To people with high lead in their water pipes - please note that fluoride binds chemically with lead and aluminium, causing even higher levels of these elements to be retained in the body - here is a link to some info: http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medi...p?newsid=25017
Remember, Mother Nature REDUCES the fluoride in a nursing mother's milk down to 0.004ppm - 250 times this amount is dumped into the public water supply. Good Luck. LEARN – INFORM – CAUSE CHANGE

we use tap, i see no reason to buy bottled water when i can get it free from my kitchen.

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Audra
Mommy to
James 8-26-03
Ayla 2-23-06

Hi. If you live in a fluoridated tapwater area, then I see two very good reasons in your photos why you should at least check out some of the links I have provided. Too many people are unaware of the negative side of this practice, so for your babies sake, view the material and make an educated decision, then take the authorities to task for not supplying you with clean, chemical-free water. Good Luck.

Eues Ireland - I'm just curious what your background is as far as education/occupation? I've seen you on several different boards (April 06, Aug 06 babies) and the only comments I've seen you make are bashing fluoride. I work for pediatric dentists and I know the American Academy of Pediatric Dentistry, as well as the American Academy of Pediatrics promote fluoride. I agree that too much of it could cause fluorosis or problems with adult teeth but that's why it's important to educate people so that everyone is getting the appropriate amount. The fluoride in tap water or fluoride supplements is a little tiny microdose designed to help developing teeth. The fluoride in toothpaste is in such a higher content, designed to strengthen the teeth already present in the mouth. When in toothpaste or fluoride rinses, it helps decrease the risk of cavities or helps keep cavities already present from getting bigger. It's when someone is already getting fluoride via tap water or supplements and then swallowing toothpaste on top of that that too much is an issue. We have a community near us who is not typically fluoridated so all the kids receive supplements and a couple years back, they had a water supply problem and borrowed water, unknowingly to the residents, from a fluoridated community. So all those children were given too much. I agree that that's a problem. But fluoride, when dosed appropriately, is a GOOD thing. Why are you coming on to SK just to bash it, I don't get it!

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Kara ~ Proud Mom to 2 boys
Married to Nick 9*7*02
Christian born 7*18*03 ~ 6lbs 14oz
Jacob born 4*12*06 ~ 7lbs 1oz

Dear Mom2ChristianNJacob,

Funny, I never thought of myself as “bashing” anything – just thought it was my civic duty to inform people about what I have learnt in studying the fluoride debate (and a debate involves facts, not bashing – that is called invective). The reason I have been posting to this site is because I subscribe to yahoo alerts about fluoride and fluoridation and the site just popped up. When I had a look, I was literally horrified by the fact of mothers casually discussing fluoride additives, etc for their babies! I was trying to highlight the information which is obviously not getting to them about NOT giving fluoride to babies – as mentioned by your own government’s announcements. Because I care a great deal about my own babies and those of everyone, I could not help but write.
I am sure that you, also, care greatly about babies and children. Therefore, before I answer your questions, I would appreciate your replies to the following, given that you have the “advantage” of some dental expertise. You see, part of the problem is that dentists in general do not look beyond the teeth at the whole body effects of fluoride. Even the 2000 York Report – a scientific forum and university task force which was put together by the UK government to “prove” the efficacy of fluoridation, said the following “We were unable to discover any reliable good-quality evidence in the fluoridation literature world-wide.”
So, Mom2ChristianNJacob, to begin:

1. Please define an 'appropriate amount' of fluoride.
2. Should this be ingested or applied as per the CDC 1999?
3. If ingested, at what total daily intake has fluoride been proven safe?
4. Since fluoride exposure in babies --now recognised as a risk period for
dental fluorosis in the permanent teeth (ADA 9th Nov 2006) --- leads to
dental fluorosis, please explain the means by which dental fluorosis is
caused by fluoride ie which developmental process is affected ?
5. And finally, but by no means least, why is mother’s milk free of fluoride?

Mom2ChristianNJacob, if you can answer these questions, then you will know why I am against fluoridation of public water supplies, and why you should be, too.
For anyone interested, contact me at euesireland@eircom.net and I will send you some links to help you start your investigations of fluoride.
Best Regards,
Brian

Brian, as you can clearly see in my signature, my name is Kara.

I still don't understand why you've come to SK - SHE knows - when I see now that you're not a SHE to begin with. And why is it exactly that you didn't answer my questions until I would 1st answer yours? That's just looney. And while part of me thinks that this is a big waste of my time, hopefully this will educate you as well! I am not a physician and I don't have all the answers. The 'appropriate' amount of fluoride for babies I believe is 6 mo to 3 yrs old is .25 mg a day, taken preferrably at a time of day when the child is not drinking milk/calcium products in a 2 hour window. That way the fluoride can be best absorbed. For children 3 - 6 yrs old, the dose goes to .50 mg a day. Then for 6 - 16 yrs, the dose is 1mg a day. That is for children without fluoride in their water. If there's a child who doesn't have it, but maybe daycare does, then it would be appropriate to cut down by half maybe so the child isn't receiving too much. As I said in my initial response, the fluoride in water or fluoride supplements should be ingested. The fluoride in toothpaste or rinses are meant for a different purpose, to help the teeth already present in the mouth. And those should be applied. Fluoride has been shown to be safe in the amounts I mentioned above, if it wasn't safe, doctors wouldn't be routinely prescribing those amounts. It is believed that the process affected by fluoride is that the 'overdose' has a negative effect on the cells involved in enamel formation. And to the absurd question of why is Mother's milk fluoride-free... why do breastfed babies require vitamin supplements, why is mother's milk not all that we live off? Because while it has the largest amount of nutrients known to us to be beneficial to babies, it doesn't have everything in it beneficial to babies. That was a very silly question. While fluorosis had been recognized as an endemic problem in parts of the Punjab, Andhra Pradesh, Karnataka, Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh, it hasn't been in the United States. Because we are educated on using fluoride in the right amounts.

Honestly, I don't care at this point whether you choose to respond, or answer my initial question of what your educational background is. I'm obviously not going to have a lightbulb come on and decide you're 100% correct and take my children completely off fluoride. And you're obviously not going to sign up your children (do you even have children?) for fluoride prescriptions. So I'm quite fine with raising my children the way my husband and I, our pediatrician, and our pediatric dentist feel is in their best interest. Let's check back in in 15 years and see the quality of their teeth. I know they'll be outstanding.

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Kara ~ Proud Mom to 2 boys
Married to Nick 9*7*02
Christian born 7*18*03 ~ 6lbs 14oz
Jacob born 4*12*06 ~ 7lbs 1oz

Ok Kara, I am going to keep this short because I can see your mind is made up and filled with years of erroneous faith in the propaganda perpetrated by the fluoride lobby.
1) First off, Sorry – for being male. I didn’t know you had to be female to give people information that would help their kids. Yes, I have two kids. My partner has two and a grandchild. I already explained how I got here. I am an environmental consultant working on recycling and in charge of one of the two producers’ compliance schemes for WEEE recycling. I have studied the fluoride issue for 6 years.
2) I wanted to see how much you knew about fluoride, that is why I asked you those questions. I guess your answers are typical of many moms’ perceptions.
3) Doctors in Europe gave up prescribing fluoride additives in the early 90’s.
4) According to the CDC – babies under 1 year should be given NO fluoride. Many doctors say none under 4 years of age should receive it. The “positive” effect was previously claimed to be for 5-12 year olds. There is no proven safe level, simply because in 60 years, there has NEVER been a long-term health study on a fluoridated population – hard to believe isn’t it?
5) If you have to avoid calcium in taking fluoride – how can it be good for bones? Fluoride has a reputation for making bones and teeth brittle.
6) According to the Centers for Disease Control and the Institute of Medicine, fluoride's predominant effect is TOPICAL (direct contact with teeth) and not systemic (from ingestion).
7) The FIRST year of baby’s life determines whether they get fluorosis in PERMANENT teeth or not. The developmental process affected that causes fluorosis is via thyroid function, which also delays the eruption process.
8) If you like, I will send you a list of web links which show many scientists, toxicologists, doctors and dentists do NOT think the level of 1ppm is safe
9) Fluoride has its topical effect by killing enzymes which digest sugars and thereby create the acid which eats into enamel. Enzymes are basic neuro transmitters throughout the body. Does the fluoride know which ones to attack, and which not?
10) If a mother ingests 100 times the “optimum” amount of fluoride – her body will still filter it down to a fraction (0.004ppm) in her breast milk – do you not think Mother Nature is trying to tell you something there?
11) Pradesh, Karnataka, Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh, > This is due to high levels of fluoride in ground water 4-8ppm which is causing crippling skeletal fluorosis – an effect which starts at only 3-4ppm , not because they are less educated – at least they try to take it OUT!
12) I try my best to get people to educate themselves and not continue to accept the cynical propaganda of the fluoride lobby. I cannot, and would not want to, make up your mind for you. All I hope to do is make you think – and educate yourself. We share the wish that your, and my, kids’ teeth will be perfect. Meet you here in 15 years. Best Regards, Brian

well funny that that I gave you my answers and you still didn't give me your educational/occupational background. I'm not surprised really.

I don't know where you get your information, nor do I care to spend the time disputing it. As we both agree that we're not going to see eye-to-eye on this, or probably many things. Like I said, I choose to listen to physicians and the educational classes I've taken and I feel very comfortable that my children will be raised extremely well, healthy & with beautiful smiles. Have you ever actually spoken with a pediatric dentist regarding your concerns and their fluoride dosing? I suggest you do as they may help answer your fluoride issues better than I was able to.

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Kara ~ Proud Mom to 2 boys
Married to Nick 9*7*02
Christian born 7*18*03 ~ 6lbs 14oz
Jacob born 4*12*06 ~ 7lbs 1oz

For those of you that use tap water, do you still boil it ? Where I live we have what is supposed to be one of the best local water supplies in the world. (Gibsons, BC)

I have always boiled his water and at 5.5 months, I still do. I have read that after 4 months or so you don't have to boil it ????

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Lurking from BIN -
I think the matter of discusion is very interesting.
Here's a good link that states what the CDC recommends for fluoride dosage measured by weight.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dental_fluorosis
Also I thought this article was interesting...http://parents.com/parents/story.jht...l&catref=prt83
If you notice the correlation between the dates of increase in cases of fluorosis and increase in broken bones due to calcuim deficiency in the US, interesting, since fluoride inhibits the absorbtion of calcium. WOW!!!

At any rate if you have concerns about using your local tap water at all, I'd suggest looking up your local water treatment's yearly reports.
Just found out DS#1 is getting an overdose of fluoride because I use children's fluoride toothpaste and tap water.
Also that our water treatment plant was in 6 violations related to fluoride in December of 2005.
Brian, I was against you at first. But now, after doing a little research, I thank you and my children thank you

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i use nursery water and it's really not too expensive it's only about $1.29 for a gallon!

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I was using distilled water for about a month, until people started telling me I didn't need to use it. Now we just use tap water. My son has been perfectly fine either way. No harm done.

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